Once Saved Always Saved

Once Saved Always Saved, or Perseverance of the Saints, is an interesting topic. I'm going to post what I see in the Bible. Obviously, there are a lot of people who have a different opinion on it (and they have Bible verses that back up their position ... I think) so if you disagree, please disagree politely. I'm willing to have a civil discussion on this if you want to :)

The definition of Once Saved Always Saved is that when a person becomes a Christian, their salvation is sealed for all eternity. No matter what they do in their life after that point, they are always going to Heaven because of the decision they made at one point in their life.**

So, do I believe in Once Saved Always Saved?

No, I don't. I believe that it is possible for Christians to lose their salvation. Here's some verses that back up my position:

Mark 4:2-20 (Parable of the Sower/Seeds/Earth)

In this parable, Jesus talks about different types of people that receive the gospel and then fall away. Some reasons that they fall away include:

• Satan takes away the Word (path)
• Trouble or persecution (rocky ground)
• Worries of this life/deceitfulness of wealth/desires for other things (thistles)

I'm not going to give teaching on what each of these things are and how to avoid them in this post, since that's not my purpose here - we're discussing Once Saved Always Saved.

2 Timothy 2:11-13

This is a 'trustworthy saying' that Paul includes in his second letter to Timothy.
In it he says that if we disown Jesus, he will disown us.
If we are faithless, he remains faithful.

So what's the difference between disowning Jesus and being faithless?

The difference I see is that 'disowning' must be a conscious choice. You don't disown something by accident. You have to decide to disown it. However, you can slip into faithlessness without ever once making a conscious decision to cross the line of faithlessness, because there is no line.

So I don't believe you can 'lose' your salvation, but you can 'give it back'.

So now we come to the two questions.

First, what is the truth? What I see in the Bible is that it is theoretically possible for a believer to lose their salvation.

Second, how then shall we live? For each person individually, Once Saved Always Saved doesn't really matter to you. If you can't accidentally lose your salvation, then you don't need to worry about doing so. At any time, you will be either:

a) A believer who has a relationship with God and is 'saved', and therefore does not have to worry
b) A nonbeliever who does not have a relationship with God and does not care that they are not 'saved', and therefore does not have to worry*
or c) A nonbeliever who does not have a relationship with God but wants to have a relationship with God. In that case, we have good news for you. It's called the gospel. :)

*Well, they should worry that they are not going to Heaven when they die. But the doctrine of Once Saved Always Saved shouldn't worry them.

For those who are saved and are worried about losing their salvation:

“Never will I leave you; never will I forsake you.” (Hebrews 13:5b)

But still:

Therefore, my dear friends, as you have always obeyed—not only in my presence, but now much more in my absence—continue to work out your salvation with fear and trembling, for it is God who works in you to will and to act in order to fulfill his good purpose. (Philippians 2:12-13)

What I see in this verse is that there is a part for us to play in remaining saved, and that we are to pursue that with 'fear and trembling'. But then go back to Hebrews 13:5b again. :)

The time when Once Saved Always Saved does worry people is when they are considering friends who at one time avowed Christ, but now seem to have slipped away from the faith. In those situations, the question is 'Are they still saved?'

I don't have all the answers. I can't tell you whether that person has disowned Christ or is merely faithless. What I can say is:

Preach the word; be prepared in season and out of season; correct, rebuke and encourage—with great patience and careful instruction. (2 Timothy 4:2)

But in your hearts revere Christ as Lord. Always be prepared to give an answer to everyone who asks you to give the reason for the hope that you have. But do this with gentleness and respect, keeping a clear conscience, so that those who speak maliciously against your good behavior in Christ may be ashamed of their slander. (1 Peter 3:15-16)

Pray for your friend. Pray for opportunities to remind them of the gospel and of the faith they once avowed. But do this with gentleness and respect. Don't force it on them, but be bold.

And in all things, to God be the glory.

S. D. G.

**A footnote. Some will say that this a straw man argument, and that I am missing the point, as it says in Romans 6:1-2: Shall we go on sinning ... By no means! We are those who have died to sin; how can we live in it any longer? I agree that the doctrine of Once Saved Always Saved does not (or should not) give permission for people to do whatever they want. However, we are debating the second of the two questions at this point without discovering the truth of the first question.

The Two Questions: A Framework

I was planning some more posts for the future (some of them requested by readers ... er, a reader, singular) and I realized that this framework is applicable to many of them. So it's in its own post so that I can easily refer back to it.

When discussing an issue, there are two big questions to ask:

1. What should we believe about this issue? (or, what is truth?)
2. What should we do about this issue? (or, how then shall we live?)

It's important to ask both of these questions together. Neither of them should be separated from the other for very long.

The reason is that my actions follow my beliefs. If my beliefs are wrong, then my actions will also be wrong. If my beliefs are right, then my actions will be right.

It's unfair to expect people to act in a right way if they have wrong beliefs. If they don't have the proper grounding in what is true, then of course they won't act in a way consistent with the truth that they don't have.

That's why it's impossible to legislate right actions. A law may increase right actions, but it is very difficult to completely eliminate wrong actions. That's because making a law about something doesn't change people's beliefs about it. The reason that some people's actions do change is because of their belief that 'I should follow the law' or, at the very least, 'I will be punished if I do not follow the law'.

It also goes the other way. If my beliefs inspire my actions, then conversely, my actions should reflect my beliefs. And someone should be able to correctly identify my beliefs based on a knowledge of my actions. (Matthew 7:16)

So why is it important to ask these two questions together?

We can't just ask question 1. If we don't follow it up with question 2, then it remains nothing more than a belief. (Okay ... it will influence our actions, even if we don't realise it is. But I think it's still a good idea to clarify what our actions should be, based on our beliefs. Plus, it acts as a check on our beliefs.)

We can't just ask question 2. As I've already said, we can't come to a correct understanding of what we should do if we don't first have a correct understanding of what is true.

There are some issues where Christians (or people who call themselves Christians) disagree. I feel like applying this framework in those situations could help to allow both sides to understand each other better. Are we disagreeing about an issue because our beliefs differ? If so, then we should inspect Scripture to discover what the truth is (or whether it is an issue on which Christians can legitimately disagree). If we agree in our beliefs and it is our actions that differ, then we can affirm our common ground, stop calling each other names, and work through why we respond to the issue differently. (Which, I imagine, is probably because of other beliefs that interact with our belief about the issue.)

So, next time you are faced with an issue, stop and ask these two questions:
1. What is the truth?
2. How then shall we live?

Definitions
right: consistent with Biblical teaching and principles
wrong: not consistent with Biblical teaching and principles
belief: what you think is true
action: what you do

Honesty and Politeness

Honesty is better than politeness. - Cyrus

I've heard this a couple of times. One example is when someone asks you "How are you?"
The polite answer: I'm fine, thanks.
The honest answer: (well, this depends on how you actually are. Be honest!)

By answering with the polite answer, you've missed an opportunity to connect with the person who asked you how you were.

So after I heard this idea, I tried answering questions honestly, rather than politely.

That didn't go too well. Some of my honest answers weren't helpful to the person who had asked me the question. Sometimes, what I was thinking and said honestly was the wrong thing to say and it was hurtful to the person I said it to.

The thing is that while honesty is important, it's not the most important thing. When asked about the greatest commandment, the two commandments that Jesus talked about shared a common theme: Love.

So my modified statement is that honesty is better than politeness, but it has to be honesty tempered with love. Honesty tempered by fear is politeness (I'll say the truth unless it will make you not like me), but honesty tempered with love says "How can I build up my brother or sister in Christ?"

Ideally, in the end, our thoughts will all be ones of love, and we will be able to speak honestly without thinking about tempering our words with love - our words will be of love just because that's what is in our hearts. But personally, I'm not there yet. My thoughts aren't all pure. But by God's grace, I'm learning to speak from love rather than from fear or other motives.

I am not the man I ought to be, I am not the man I wish to be, and I am not the man I hope to be, but by the grace of God, I am not the man I used to be. - John Newton (paraphrased)

Honesty + Love > Politeness

S. D. G.

Living Life Intentionally

When you look back on your life, what do you want to see? - Connor, a friend of mine (at a working bee we were at last weekend)

My answer (after some thought): I would like to see a life lived intentionally to make a difference in this world for Jesus.

The night before, I had a discussion with another friend (actually, the older brother of Connor, who asked me the first question mentioned). One of the topics we discussed was 1 Corinthians 13:11, which says:

When I was a child, I talked like a child, I thought like a child, I reasoned like a child. When I became a man, I put the ways of childhood behind me. - 1 Corinthians 13:11

His definition of 'the ways of childhood' was 'something that doesn't have eternal value'. I like this definition. It doesn't fall into legalism (you must do that vs. you must not do that) or permissiveness.

My example would be that I don't normally play/build with LEGO or buy it anymore, but I'll still play a game with my younger siblings. The eternal value is that I'm investing in their lives as I play with them.

A line from a song I heard over the weekend: I don't want to spend my whole life asking 'What if I had given everything?' (link to song)

This idea is one of my main 'takeaways' from the working bee I was at. A filter to pass everything I do or think about doing through: Does this activity hold eternal value? If not, then I should seriously consider whether I should be doing it.

Don't waste your life. Live life intentionally for Jesus.

Psalm 37

Trust in the LORD and do good; dwell in the land and enjoy safe pasture.

Take delight in the LORD, and he will give you the desires of your heart.

Commit your way to the LORD; trust in him and he will do this:

He will make your righteous reward shine like the dawn,

your vindication like the noonday sun.

Psalm 37:3-6

This psalm paints a picture of what life looks like for the righteous. Although at times they may be poor (37:16), and sometimes it may take waiting (37:7), God's reward will be with them. He is their stronghold in times of trouble (37:39).

What I see in this chapter, basically, is a life that may not have all of the world's pleasures. In some places, it looks hard. There's waiting. Turning to evil looks like a quick and easy way to become wealthy. In fact, there's really only one reward that the righteous get.

But that reward's worth it. The LORD is the reward of the righteous. While there are side effects (37:4; 'he will give you the desires of your heart', 37:19; 'in days of famine they will enjoy plenty', 37:29: 'the righteous will inherit the land and dwell in it forever'), the reward of the righteous, above and beyond all of those, is the LORD himself.

Take verse 4: Take delight in the LORD, and he will give you the desires of your heart.

At first glance, this may seem like a way to get what you want. Just fulfill the condition in the first part of the verse, and God has promised to give you whatever your heart desires.

However, it's not quite as simple as that. Take delight in the LORD. If your delight is in the LORD, what will be the desires of your heart? To serve Him? To know Him better? To become more like Him? To lift up the broken, the weary, the weak, the destitute? Maybe another way of thinking about the verse is 'Take delight in the LORD, and he will give you the desires of His heart to be the desires of your heart.'

Be still before the LORD and wait patiently for him;

do not fret when people succeed in their ways,

when they carry out the wicked schemes.

Psalm 37:7

Better the little that the righteous have than the wealth of many wicked;
for the power of the wicked will be broken,

but the Lord upholds the righteous.

Psalm 37:16-17

S.D.G.

Take me deeper than my feet could ever wander

Link to Oceans

You call me out upon the waters
The great unknown
Where feet may fail
And there I find you in the mystery
In oceans deep
My faith will stand

I'm sure many of you are familiar with this song, Oceans, from Hillsong. I'm sure many of you love it. I know I do - it's one of my favourite songs. The bridges especially stand out:

Spirit lead me where my trust is without borders
Let me walk upon the waters
Wherever you would call me

Take me deeper than my feet could ever wander
And my faith will be made stronger
In the presence of my Saviour

But do we actually realize what we're singing in that bridge? We're asking God to take us to where our trust has no borders. No borders at all. No safety. No security. No familiarity. We're saying to God "We're ready to go wherever you send us to do whatever you want us to do. No questions asked."

Do we actually mean that? Are we actually willing to follow God where our trust has no borders? Because if we don't, you could argue that we shouldn't actually be singing the song.

This question was posed (well, posed more as a thought) at a Bible study which I was attending/running on Thursday evening. Are we actually willing to go where our trust has no borders?

If I'm being honest with myself, I'd have to say that no, at the moment, there are situations which would totally stop me in my tracks, situations that I would have no idea what to do with.

But at the same time, I don't want to stay there. I want to know my Father better. I want to experience more of His heart. I want to press in closer to Him. And while Jesus didn't have prerequisites for people coming to Him (stop sinning, get a job, have a shower) he did require change after they did come to Him. Go and sin no more, go and leave your life of sin, stop sinning or something worse will happen to you.

I believe that principle can be applied here. No, maybe I'm not ready to go wherever God leads me. But I'm asking Him to change me, to grow me, to transform me, to mold me into who He wants me to be. And part of that is childlike trust, childlike faith. He wants us to be willing to trust Him completely, to go wherever His Spirit leads us. And that will be difficult. He promised that. (John 16:33). But it will be worth it in the end. Being like Jesus, being with Jesus, will be worth it in the end. When He wipes away every tear from our eyes and says "Well done, my good and faithful servant," everything will be worth it.

It's not up to us to change ourselves into who God wants us to be. That's what He does. Yet in a way, it's totally up to us. This is one of the strange balances in this world, where two things that seem to be complete opposites can and are both completely true. Justice and mercy. Predestination and free will. Working out our salvation with fear and trembling yet also resting in God's love and grace and the completeness of His finished work on the cross.

And in a way, it doesn't matter whether or not I'm ready yet to go wherever God will lead me. We don't need to see the end of the journey. All we need is the next step. I struggle with this. In my humanity, in my brokenness, I want to know how everything is going to work out. I want God to provide me with an exact roadmap of how He is going to deal with me and where He is going to lead me for the rest of my life. But that's not always how God works. He leads us one step at a time. If we always knew exactly where we were going over the next year, over the next five years, over the next ten years, then where would faith be?

Actually, faith requires that we don't know, that we aren't ready. If we're prepared to meet any situation, then we aren't trusting God, we're trusting ourselves.

Oceans isn't a declaration of supreme faith and borderless trust. It's a cry to God to bring us to where He wants us to be. And it's my cry. Father, make me more like you. Lead me where my trust is without borders. More of You and less of me, Lord.

And I will call upon Your Name
And keep my eyes above the waves
When oceans rise
My soul will rest in Your embrace
For I am Yours and You are mine

S. D. G.

On Proving the Nonexistence of God

Let us assume that a divine being exists. Furthermore, this divine being, in addition to being immaterial and supernatural, is also omnipotent and omniscient.

Any divine being possessing these characteristics could blind any non-divine being as to the existence of the divine being, and, if they wished, could make it appear that they never existed. Therefore, it is impossible for any non-divine being to prove the nonexistence of a divine being.

"Ah!" but the sceptic says. "If it is impossible for me to disprove a divine being, it is equally impossible for you to prove one."

Not so. The reason that a divine being can't be disproved is that the possibility of the prescence of a divine being brings any natural processes into question. If we start from the assumption that there is no divine being, then there is no supernatural to confuse the natural.

This reason doesn't prove a divine being, any more than it disproves one. All it does is disprove the disprovability of a divine being.

In summary: A divine being could hide itself, so we can't say there isn't one.

^ ^ ^ That's what I thought of while practicing violin today. It doesn't take into account why a divine being would want to hide their existence, but I didn't think it was necessary in order to make my argument clear.

Any critiques? Thoughts? Feel free to play devil's advocate :)